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J.U.:Theproblemwiththat,ofcourse,isthattheFranklinExpeditionwasn,t
reallyaCanadiandisaster.ItwasanEnglishdisaster.
D.F.:Quite.That,sasignificantcorrection.
J.U.:IalwaysthinkofFranklinandhisexpeditionandotherArcticexpeditions
asanotherexampleofbizarremalesuicide.Somemenseemtobedrivento
throwthemselvesintoimpossiblesituationswhentheyknowperfectlywell
they,regoingtodie.But,Isuppose,beingfrozenintoArcticiceismore
interestingthantakinganoverdoseorhangingoneselfinsomebanalwayin
agarage.NeverthelessIamcompletelyfascinated(asmanyCanadiansare)by
thewholeNorthwestPassagestory.Oneofthethingsthatinterestedmewas
howFranklintookalongalibraryofmanyvolumesontheship,andSterling
silverteaservicesandRoyalDoultonchina.Asifhebelievedhecould
domesticatetheArctic.Soyearslater,apparently,prospectorsandexplorersin
theArcticwouldcomeacrossanInuithunterwhowouldhavenothinginhis
igloobutskinsandhidesandaSterlingsilverteapot.
D.F.:AnotherwordthatcameupinourdiscussionisthecrucialCanadianword:pioneers.I,m
familiarwiththeconceptasitsurfacesinMargaretLaurence,sfiction.I,malsofamiliarwiththe
importanceofpioneersinliterarydiscourse,whenIthinkofLaurenceandhertributetoCatharine
ParrTraill,orwhenIthinkofCarolShieldsandhertributetoSusannaMoodie.Whoisyour
pioneer,eitherliterallyorasawriter?
J.U.:Idon,tnecessarilyidentifywiththewomenthatwewouldconsidertobe
pioneerwriters.Primarily,Ithink,becausetheywereEnglish.Iadmirethe
writing,andI,mdelightedbyit,andI,mveryinterestedintheinformationithas
givenme,butIdon,tidentifywiththem,because,regardlessofwheretheywere
living,asthewivesofBritishofficerstheywereconnectedtoanestablished
system.ThetypeofpioneerexperiencethatIfindIidentifywithwouldbemuch
rougher,muchtougher,eventhanRoughingItintheBush.
Ithinkthattherearemanyotherpioneerstoriesthatneedtobetoldin
Canada:storiesconcerningPolishpioneers,Ukrainianpioneers,Swedishpio-
neers,Icelandicpioneers,andofcourse,Frenchpioneers.Theimmigrantexpe-
rienceinCanadaisastoryofdislocationmorethananythingelse,sothatI
wouldsaythatpeoplefromAfricaarrivinglastweekarepioneersinthesame
waythatmyIrishancestorswerepioneers.Theexperienceofmigrationunitesus
all;theexperienceofcomingtoanewplace,andhavingsomehowtochopout
yourownlittlespaceinthewilderness.
D.F.:That,saninterestingimage.Howdoyoudothatinliterature,whenyouchopoutyourown
space?